Saturday, May 13, 2017

The JimFear138 Podcast Ep.52 - Fuck Oklahoma, Superversive Superheroes, & Comey









Hello everyone, and welcome to another episode of the podcast! This time I go over a new law in Oklahoma that will go into effect November 1st that will DRASTICALLY fuck men over in divorce/custody cases, talk about Russel Newquist's new Superversive Superheroes anthology, and then yell and scream about the stupid Comey thing. Hope y'all enjoy!

MP3 Download of this episode:  https://ia600408.us.archive.org/25/items/jimfear_audio_productions/Ep52.mp3

Turd Flinging Monkey's Video: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ylYY3kIp6fg

NewsOK Article: http://newsok.com/article/5548406

Article Archive: http://archive.is/24f6v

Text of the Bill: https://legiscan.com/OK/text/HB1121/id/1524694

Bill Sponsors: https://legiscan.com/OK/bill/HB1121/2017

Oklahoma Marriage/Divorce Report 2013: https://www.ok.gov/health2/documents/HCI_Marriage%20and%20Divorce_1990_2013.pdf

Woman Who Threatened To Falsely Accuse Uber Driver of Raping Her Because He Didn't Have a Phone Charger:  https://www.thesun.co.uk/news/3268135/uber-driver-accused-rape-phone-charger-rant/

Archive of The Sun Article: http://archive.is/GG0zc

Statute of Limitations in Oklahoma: http://www.justanswer.com/criminal-law/53znv-oklahoma-statute-limitations-domestic.html



Russel Newquist's Extended Deadline for Submissions: http://russellnewquist.com/2017/05/superheroes-anthology-submissions-still-open/

Submission Guidelines: http://russellnewquist.com/2017/02/superversive-superheroes-submissions-still-open/






Social Media Dump

Opening Music:
Honey Bee Kevin MacLeod (incompetech.com)
Licensed under Creative Commons: By Attribution 3.0 License

Saturday, May 6, 2017

The JimFear138 Podcast Ep.51 - #FireColbert, FGM vs MGM, & Sex Robots








Hello everyone and welcome to another episode of the podcast! In this one I go over the retardation with #FireColbert, talk about female genital mutilation with regards to male genital mutilation, and talk about sex robots for a little while. Hope y'all enjoy!

MP3 Download of this episode: https://ia800408.us.archive.org/25/items/jimfear_audio_productions/Ep51.mp3

The tweet from the sex robot company:  https://twitter.com/AbyssCreations/status/850079851990077440

Oghma on Twitter: https://twitter.com/Oghma_EM

huMAN: https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCT2dUsMtd08RfaH12O9DCDg

Coterie: https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCnYBk3rcTaYN-LLwopSZjig

Social Media Dump

Opening Music:
Honey Bee Kevin MacLeod (incompetech.com)
Licensed under Creative Commons: By Attribution 3.0 License

Monday, May 1, 2017

Manowar is Pulp


Okay, so if you follow me on twitter, then you know that occasionally I get drunk and go on a tear posting music. Sometimes I'll nominate songs as the unofficial theme songs of the Pulp Revolution, and pretty much 100% of these songs have been from the band Manowar, and I figured I would take a bit to tell you why. I also haven't posted much PulpRev stuff lately, and it's about time, I reckon.

I think it's safe to say that Manowar is pretty much the most Pulp band in existence. There are other contenders for that title, but in my opinion they all pale in comparison to the kings of metal. You could nominate Black Sabbath, but they don't go hard or fast enough. You could nominate Rainbow, but I don't think they capture the essence of pulp in their songs quite as frequently as Manowar. You could nominate Dio, and then I'd say that you have a serious contender, but even the Godfather of Heavy Metal himself can't keep up with the brazen, unabashed, prideful power of Manowar.

If you can't tell, I really, really like this band.

But how does Manowar so thoroughly embody pulp, as I claim they do? Well, if we take a look at Misha Burnett's Five Pillars of Pulp Revival (not quite the same thing as the Pulp Revolution, but close enough for our purposes), we see that the pulps of yesteryear have as primary focuses Action, Impact, Moral Peril, Romance, and Mystery. I am of the opinion that, in one song or another, Manowar brings these qualities to the fore and runs with them like a viking at his enemies, swinging a sword or warhammer above his head, screaming to Thor to give him strength with which to slay.

Now that might sound a bit hyperbolic, but I'm in fact deadly serious.

Manowar is the physical embodiment of power metal. For those who are unaware, because I realize that this isn't exactly everyone's bag, power metal usually features actual singing (combined with high-pitched operatic shrieks), properly tuned guitars that play actual harmonies (sometimes dual-guitar harmonics, which is always nice), powerful drum lines, talented bassists who are doing so much more than keeping time, and the lyrics are usually focused on fantasy scenarios, but not always. A good few examples of fantasy-based power metal are Dio's albums Killing The Dragon, Master of the Moon, and Sacred Heart. He actually went out on stage in the 80's with a giant green dragon prop that breathed fire, and he had a light sword that he would fight it with over the course of the live shows! Manowar tackles non-fantasy based power metal with their first album. The first song is about motorcycles & motorcycle gangs, and the song "Shell Shock" is about a Vietnam veteran re-adjusting to life in peacetime. So power metal doesn't have to be based in fantasy type storytelling, but most of it is. Even lots of Manowar's songs are.

So I was talking about those five pillars of pulp earlier before I got sidetracked, and before I get sidetracked again I should probably elucidate about how Manowar fills them out in their music.

First we have Action. Well, I think it's safe to say that the boys in Manowar have this covered. Many of their songs are action oriented, and involve depictions of bloody battles and brothers in arms coming together to defeat cowering foes that knew not what they were dealing with. I'll post a song with each pillar to demonstrate what I'm talking about, and so you guys know I'm not just funnin' ya. Here's a good one to demonstrate Action, "Black Wind, Fire, and Steel" from their album Fighting The World. It's also one of my personal favorites.

Apparently Blogger wants to be a lil shit, and won't let me embed the video, so here's a link to the song. 

Next we have Impact. Misha defines this as the characters being fallible, and their actions having consequences. Well say no more, I have the perfect song! Now this song does start after he did his fallible thing, but the character in this song is very much fallible, and does pay for it, then returns to wreak havoc on those who did him wrong. The song is "Dark Avenger" from the album Battle Hymns, and actually features narration by Orson Welles! Funny story about that, apparently Welles was so impressed by the copy they gave him to read, he thought that it was written by one of the classic authors that people used to read in school, like it was something out of The Odyssey or one of those old tales. Turns out it was written by the bassist, far right in the picture above, and he was pretty embarrassed about being compared to the classical masters by Orson Welles. Can't say I blame him, that's some heavy praise. But yeah, the song is very good, and I believe it adequately represents characters being fallible, especially because the guy does some extremely not so savory things after he returns to seek vengeance.

And once again Blogger doesn't seem to want to give me the proper YouTube results, so I'll just continue linking the songs because I think I see a trend developing.

Next we have Moral Peril. Misha characterizes this as the character seeing the easier path morally, and avoiding taking it. In effect, taking great pains to not become the thing they're fighting. Maybe I'm being a bit too liberal with my interpretation of this (which I'll probably do again, fair warning), but I think this can also be interpreted to succumbing to madness after something like being in a war zone. This I think is adequately embodied in the song "Shell Shock" from Battle Hymns. I'm not gonna lie, I've listened to all their albums, and this was a tough number to fill. Most of their songs about warriors and whatnot usually involve them killing without mercy, raping women, and generally slaughtering and pillaging at whim. But this song shows another side to the conflict, that of the warrior come home from the battlefield and not knowing what to do with himself, as so many Vietnam veterans did. You can decide for yourself if I'm fudging a bit too much here, but I think I'm within the spirit of the rules if not their strict boundaries. Here's the link to the song.

Next we have Romance. This is another one I'm probably going to be fudging a bit. It could be argued that the protagonist of "Dark Avenger" is motivated in part by Romance, due to what happened to his wife and children, but there's not exactly a satisfying denouement to that story. He doesn't really reunite with them, just kills the people that inflicted pain on them. But thankfully, our boys in Manowar do not disappoint. The bassist and principle song writer, Joey DeMaio, actually wrote a song based on The Iliad, which while a war story is also a love story about a man going to war to rescue the woman he loves. Now the song is damn near a half hour long, and it has been a while since I listened to it, but I'll include the link anyway so you can hear for yourself. The song is "Achilles: Agony & Ecstasy In 8 Parts" from their album The Triumph of Steel.

But if that's not good enough, they also did a version of "Nessun Dorma" on their album Warriors of the World. From Wikipedia (Infogalactic just would not load for some reason),
"Nessun dorma" (Italian: [nesˈsun ˈdɔrma]; English: "None shall sleep")[1] is an aria from the final act of Giacomo Puccini's opera Turandot and one of the best-known tenor arias in all opera. It is sung by Calaf, il principe ignoto (the unknown prince), who falls in love at first sight with the beautiful but cold Princess Turandot. However, any man who wishes to wed Turandot must first answer her three riddles; if he fails, he will be beheaded. In the aria, Calaf expresses his triumphant assurance that he will win the princess." 
Now if THAT doesn't scream "ROMANCE" at the top of its lungs, I don't know what does. This song also shows off how supremely talented Manowar are, especially the singer Eric Adams. He does an amazing job with this song, and it is very soaring and inspiring to listen to, even if you don't know what he's saying because you don't speak Italian. Here's the link.

Finally we have Mystery. Misha defines this as a sense of the unknown, and Manowar certainly brings this to the table in their music. The song "Master of the Wind" from The Triumph of Steel is a good example among many, bringing together elements of folklore and legend to paint a picture of a mystical world where all is not what it seems. The song implies that there is something out there that we just can't explain, but even if we don't take understand it, we can still take advantage of it and change our destiny, because fortune favors the bold, after all. Here's the link to the song.

Moreover than all of this, even though I went through all that trouble hunting down various songs that align with Misha's pillars, Manowar embodies the Pulp Ethos in a way few other bands do. By "Pulp Ethos", I mean the general attitude of pulp authors of yesteryear, who did literally whatever the hell they wanted, got paid for it, and many of whom became massively popular in their day because of it. Burroughs, Howard, Merritt, Leiber, all of these people wrote precisely what they wanted to, and people ate it up because it was so original and breathtaking that the quality was undeniable.

In much the same fashion, Manowar came out with a specific mission. They were going to play HEAVY METAL, they were going to sing about whatever the fuck they wanted, they were going to play fast and loud, and anyone who had shit to say about it could get fucked. That picture up there isn't a publicity shot. Them boys went out on stage like that, dressed like Conan characters, straight not giving a single fuck. In taking this attitude they not only pay tribute to the great metal bands that came before them and laid the groundwork for their music, they also perhaps unknowingly paid tribute to the great pulp writers that got America reading. Not just their choice of song topics, but their entire attitude is 100% Pulp down to its very core, and if I may be so bold I would say that there is no greater band the Pulp Revolution could look to for inspiration as to what attitude we should take going forward, as well as inspiration when the going gets rough as it inevitably will.

In my experience, writers are at their best when they're not playing to anybody but their own muse. Sky Hernstrom is an ample example of this, and I wouldn't wish to see his writing constrained by having to please a particular audience, or publisher, or anybody but precisely what motivates him to write the weird and wonderful stories he does. The essence of pulp, in my opinion, is free form. It encourages writers to write whatever the hell they want, because that is most certainly going to be more interesting than the crap put out by the big 5 publishers nowadays.

And I believe Manowar embodies this ethos to a T. What other band do you know that would not only feel totally comfortable, but absolutely justified in writing a song that includes the lines, "Burning! Death! Destruction! Raping their daughters and wives! In blood I take my payment! In full with their lives!"? I can't think of a single band that would be so bold. Not even rap musicians go that far, and rap lyrics are notoriously violent and sexual. Even Body Count, who put out a song on their first album called "Cop Killer", wouldn't do something like that. Besides that, what other band do you know whose bassist can play "Flight of the Bumblebee" on a fucking FOUR-STRING?! Yes, I am in fact deadly fucking serious.

Now I'm not suggesting that we in the Pulp Revolution take up Manowar as our band of choice, or that we adopt one of their songs as the official/unofficial theme song. Those posts are made partially in jest. Partially. While I think they do have several songs that absolutely embody the ethos of the Pulp Revolution, "Brothers of Metal" being a strong contender for that, I know that not everyone shares my taste in music. It's eclectic, and I'm frequently listening to just plain weird shit. So I understand if not everybody is digging what I'm laying down with regard to music choice. But if you're looking for some damn good music that is essentially the sonic embodiment of Pulp, you could do far worse than Manowar.

I'll put a link below to my personal favorite album of theirs on Amazon (I do have an affiliate account, after all, might as well shill), but honestly you could probably get it cheaper from your local CD shop. But looking them up on YouTube would be well worth your while, in my opinion. If you are interested in buying from Amazon, just click the image below and it'll take you right to the album. It's damn good, and it'll be money well spent if you're into that kind of music. I'd advise looking up a track listing first and giving the album a go via YouTube before you buy it, but if you do decide to buy it I'd be grateful if you used the link below.

https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B00CJCQ26I/ref=as_li_tl?ie=UTF8&tag=jimfear138-20&camp=1789&creative=9325&linkCode=as2&creativeASIN=B00CJCQ26I&linkId=8e9296e9ca2b1df5bc78d50083b642b3

And always remember!

Carry On 
My sons forever
Carry On 

When I am gone
Carry On 

For when the day is long
Forever Carry On
For as long as we together
Then forever Carry On

Saturday, April 29, 2017

The JimFear138 Podcast Ep.50 - Ad Feelz, Dumb Trump People, & Bill Nye Makes Me Want To Kill Myself









Hello everyone and welcome to another episode of the podcast! This time I talk about how weird it feels to be shilling for stuff I didn't make, go over an article about a couple Trump supporters who got what they deserved, and discuss Bill Nye The Anti-Science Guy's new Netflix show! Hope y'all enjoy!

Archive of article: http://archive.is/9xhKs

MP3 Download link of this episode: https://ia600408.us.archive.org/25/items/jimfear_audio_productions/ep50.mp3



Social Media Dump

Opening Music:
Honey Bee Kevin MacLeod (incompetech.com)
Licensed under Creative Commons: By Attribution 3.0 License

Friday, April 28, 2017

Dr. Jordan Peterson vs MGTOW





So this post is probably gonna piss some people off but so be it. I should get out of the way at the beginning that I have a lot of respect for Dr. Peterson. I enjoy his lectures, I enjoy his appearances on various podcasts, his interviews, and one day I hope to read his books when I'm not slammed wall to wall with work. He's a fascinating figure and an intelligent man, and I feel tremendous sympathy for what he went through with regards to the Canadian legal system and their flawed understanding of basic human rights. That said, I'm not going to agree with everything someone that I like says. Even my friends and I have frequent disagreements. My respect for Dr. Peterson remains, but he is wrong in his characterization of MGTOW. Fair warning folks, this is gonna be long and involved, so pull up a chair, get a drink and a smoke if you're into that kinda thing, and settle in for a long haul.

Here's his opinion, so we've got all the context worked out.

Apparently this happened early in April, and I have no idea how I missed it since I'm subscribed to several MGTOW YouTubers, and several of them made responses to this statement of Dr. Peterson's. I guess I wasn't on YouTube much the past month, but in the past couple days I've taken up my 40K model painting hobby again and I was going through my YT subscriptions and found out about this via one of the videos I watched, and I watched several responses, including those from Karen Straughan (a prominent MRA), JohntheOther, DrRandomercam, MessengerRising, TurdFlingingMonkey, and Stardusk/Thinking Ape, and I figured that I would throw my own two cents in on this. Those videos from the listed people are a good summation of my feelings on the matter, but I wanted to write this because...well, honestly I just kinda felt like responding to this.

I should probably just go ahead and say something that I've never really hidden, yes, I am a man going his own way. The individualistic philosophy appeals to my nature as a hermit as well as informing me of several things about human psychology and biology that I was not previously aware of, and gave me several tools with which to arm myself against the predations of a gynocentric legal system that is set up to bilk me of any monies and productivity I might try to use to better my own situation. It's a philosophy of self-affirmation, and let me know that my worth as a person should not be tied to anyone else's opinion, least of all the opposite sex, and that I shouldn't judge the success of my life based on the standards set on me by other people which I did not agree to and up until a couple years ago didn't realize were 100% voluntary. They let me know the dangers inherent in those standards, and made me aware of the fact that I could just walk away if I wanted to (which nobody had informed me of before), and that is exactly what I did.

This is probably going to weave in and out of my actual response to what I'll charitably call Dr. Peterson's arguments against MGTOW and my own personal experience with the philosophy, and maybe get into a few life stories to give you guys an idea of where I'm coming from. Ordinarily I'd keep to what he said, but what he said is vague. It's the old bullshit fire hose attempt that we see so often from SJW's, otherwise known as a gish-gallop, and you can spray a lot of bullshit in two minutes. It takes significantly longer to clean up.

Watching this clip of Dr. Peterson, it's clear that he's done minimal research into MGTOW as a concept, philosophy, or movement, for which he is to be commended after a fashion. Most people just get the basic idea and label us all as virgin neckbeard losers whining online about how much we hate women. He's done a bit more research than your average space cowboy, but not enough to really know what he's talking about. So I'll go through his peace verbatim, point by point, and we'll see where this leads us. No promises about a straight track, though.


"Well here's the decomposition of the fundamental archetype. The dragon of chaos differentiates on the one hand into the feminine, that's the unknown, and the feminine differentiates further into the negative feminine and the positive feminine. The negative feminine is the reason for witch hunts, it's the reason for, uh, you know..."

Now I cut that there for a reason, don't think I'm trying to play out Dr. Peterson's statements in a way that's beneficial to my arguments, even though in this format I do have that ability. I broke this off from the rest of the talk because this really has nothing to do with MGTOW, and he dives straight off from that, "...you know..." into talking about MGTOW itself, so I'm just cutting out some dross here before we get to the meat and potatoes. Dr. Peterson is heavy into mythology. That's cool, it's one of my hobbies as well. Now I haven't watched the full lecture, mostly because his comments about MGTOW don't require me to, so this is out of context and will be discarded as irrelevant to the current discussion. I will say, however, that basing an evaluation of a highly individualistic philosophy focused on helping men survive in the current year with their health, wealth, and happiness largely intact on some interpretation of a binary nature of femininity as (apparently from the slide in the video) represented by ancient goddesses seems not only anachronistic but reductionary, as well as kind of missing the damn point. Whether that's intentional or not, I don't know, but I'd rather not attribute to malice what may be attributed to ignorance or overzealous interpretations of one's primary interest. I do the same thing, and it's no great sin. I just see this whole bit here as ideological claptrap that has no bearing on men trying to survive in the current year. So on with Dr. Peterson's assessment.

"There's a whole group online, called "men going their own way," M-G-T-O-W. That's a very interesting group to go study. There's lots of them, I don't know how many of them there are. Most of them are older, many of them are men who've been through a particularly horrifying divorce for one reason or another. And they're...they've had enough of women." 

This is partially correct. As I said, Dr. Peterson has done a bit of research, just not enough. There are lots of us. It's impossible to get an accurate headcount for various reasons, but I'd put the number roughly around 40-60,000 conscious MGTOW. Conscious MGTOW refers to the men like myself who are aware of the philosophy and have consciously decided to adopt it. There are thousands; perhaps tens of thousands, perhaps hundreds of thousands, who really can say; unconscious MGTOW. These are the men who look around themselves and see the world as it is and notice that something just isn't right. They see their uncle, or their father, or their friend go through a "particularly horrifying divorce" as Dr. Peterson puts it, and realize that maybe they shouldn't put themselves in the position for that to happen to them. They know nothing of MGTOW as a philosophy or an online movement, never heard of it before, would give you a confused as hell look if you asked them about it. But because of what they've seen, either in media or their own personal lives (be it something that happened to someone close to them, or a personal experience), they've decided to avoid marriage entirely for the sake of self-preservation. Karen Straughan, in her video linked here, describes this phenomenon adequately via anec-data, telling the story of the man she's currently involved with and what he was going through and about to do before she met him, and the convincing she had to do to get him to believe that she wasn't going to do the same thing to him that his ex did.

But Dr. Peterson is right, in my estimation. At least partially. Most MGTOW men that I know of are older. Some have been through the meat grinder, others just did it because it made sense. After all, you see a man walk unknowingly into a minefield and get blown to pieces, you're probably not gonna walk into that minefield. Messenger Rising, for example, has been through that meat grinder, and with no disrespect I say that he is severely damaged because of it. He's seen this process first hand, and serves as a signpost for younger men like myself (or at least I was younger when I found his videos) brightly and vehemently laying out the dangers that face men who walk into that mine field. He's had his fucking legs blown off, and he's bitter. Frankly he deserves to be, given what I know of what he's been through. It's not my business to disclose, go watch his channel if you want to hear it straight from the horse's mouth, but suffice to say that meat grinder barely describes the horror that man has experienced, and my heart goes out to him. Here's his response to Dr. Peterson.

However a growing contingent of MGTOW are men like myself. I've been through some shitty relationships, who hasn't? But only after discovering the MRM and MGTOW did I realize exactly how large of a bullet I dodged, and I only wish I'd discovered them sooner. Here's where we get into personal shit. My last serious relationship, which lasted about two years give or take, was rocky but not necessarily unhappy until near the end. I also had assurances about things that many MGTOW warn about, because she was on the pill and I knew for a fact that she was on the pill because she took it in front of me every day. As such when we got down I didn't wear a condom. Yes, I fully understand how stupid that was, and I am forever grateful that nothing ever came of it. As I said, I dodged an immense bullet. I'm lucky that we were both young and definitely didn't want kids at the time.

After that relationship ended I fell into a depression for about a year, started interacting online more, finally decided to pick myself up by my bootstraps and get back on the horse, and gradually through one channel or another found the MRM and MGTOW. I spent a good deal of time kicking myself for how fucking retarded I'd been. Trust me, self-flagellation for my stupidity has been achieved long ago, you don't need to inform me of how idiotic I was. As I started listening to the content of people like Barbarossaa, Stardusk, Messenger, and many others, I realized that not only had I dodged a bullet, I had walked straight into a minefield and come out the other side without losing a damn thing except some pride and that year or so spent in a depressive fit. I got extremely lucky. And I knew for a fact that I could not expect that luck to repeat itself in my next relationship. So I stopped. I refused to walk back into the minefield. I counted myself lucky, and walked back into ground that I knew didn't contain any mines. I'd rather keep my legs, and indeed my life, thank you very much.

There are many men like me. We see what happened to guys like Messenger and we think to ourselves, "My god, that poor man. He may not be able to go back in time and correct his mistake, but I can learn from his experience and ensure that the same thing never happens to me." And lots of us are angry about this. I was, for a very long time. I wanted the traditional lifestyle. Wife, job, kids, all that. But after hearing about these horror stories (and developing my understanding of myself as a person) I knew that if I ever did have kids with a woman, and she took them away from me and I was unable to see them, I would kill myself. I would not be able to live with that. And given the statistics (marriages fail almost 50% of the time in America, and women are awarded child custody in upward of 90% of cases), I knew that this path was not one I wanted to chance walking down. Again, there are clear signposts indicating the minefield, I was just lucky enough to see them before I ruined my life and possibly eventually took it. And for the longest time I felt like something had been stolen from me. Not that I thought I was entitled to sex, or a relationship, or children, but the opportunity for all that had been taken away. It was very troubling, and it took me a while to get over. Something that I had been told I could get, moreover that was the ideal situation for any man, had been ripped away from me by cold, hard reality, and I knew it was never going to come back. I think it's perfectly understandable that I was angry about that. I had been fed that bullshit literally my entire life, by the media, my parents, my family, my teachers, my pastor, my friends at church, everybody had fed me the exact same lie. I bear them no ill will, because they didn't know it was a lie. They were ignorant, as I was, and I factored that into my calculus during my adjustment to my new mindset and lifestyle.

So far as "having enough of women" goes, that's also untrue. There are many MGTOW men that maintain romantic relationships with women. The only difference between them and the average guy is the relationship is on their terms and they let the women know it. Each MGTOW handles this differently. Barbarossaa, for example, has stated several times that he dates but makes it explicitly clear that he's never getting married and doesn't want children. Stardusk, on the other hand, lives his life with as little contact with women as possible. I, as another example, fill out just about every single box that Dr. Peterson ticks off in his little rant. I don't want to date, I don't care about sex, I definitely don't want to get married, I refuse to cohabit with women due to common law marriage, and I very much intend on keeping my time and resources to myself. However, unlike Stardusk, I don't avoid women. I'm friends with many women, and we get along just fine. Some of them are even, shock horror, feminists, and we're very friendly and enjoy hanging out with one another. I would never date them simply due to the realities of biology and the legal system, but I do enjoy their company and I don't go out of my way to avoid women unless they prove themselves individually to be particularly unsavory characters. There are levels to this MGTOW thing, and despite different people attempting to quantify them, it's not as cut-and-dry as people would like. Yes, some MGTOW have "had enough of women," and those that do generally have a damn good reason for it if you actually listen to what they have to say. Others, like myself, bear women in general no ill will and have no problem associating with women so long as we all understand where I'm at with regards to dating, one night stands, marriage, and the like. As I said, Dr. Peterson clearly needs to do more research, but I don't blame him, as my particular research into this philosophy took well over two years, and I can only speak from what I know of the MGTOW that I've interacted with in one fashion or another over the past three or four years.

"So they tell the young men that they're teaching, never have a permanent relationship, never share your territory with a woman, never share your possessions, make sure you never live together, and don't stay with one long enough to enter a common law relationship because you will be stripped of everything that you have. Well that's a hell of a thing to be telling people..."

Once again, Dr. Peterson has done some research, but it's lacking. This is a broad-stroke summary of some of the more extreme MGTOW positions, some of which I myself hold, as I said. We'll tackle them one by one.

"Never have a permanent relationship"

This can be interpreted several ways, and I've heard it interpreted several ways by many MGTOW, some very respected voices in the...I guess community, but that isn't really the right word. Anyway. I think Dr. Peterson really means "marriage" when he says this, and this is the one thing that all MGTOW agree on. I was around when we had this little spat, and the general consensus from nearly all corners of the mgtowsphere was that married men cannot be MGTOW. They've entered into a binding contract with the state that gives the woman full power over them, whether they knew what they were getting into or not, and as such cannot be considered to be "going their own way." They're going her way, and if she decides that she doesn't like that way, she can unilaterally change the terms of the contract without his consent and he will be forced to abide by them at the point of a gun, which is the state. So if Dr. Peterson really did mean to say "marriage" when he said "never have a permanent relationship," then he is 100% right in his assessment.

However, there are many MGTOW who tell other men (including the more "radical" guys like Barbarossaa) that men can do whatever they want. If they want to get into a long term relationship with a woman, go to and good luck, just be aware of A through Z, because all those letters and the data points they represent should be factored into your calculus when entering a long term relationship with a woman. Some guys need that. I personally don't, so I don't bother. But some men do, and the least we can do as MGTOW is make available information that men who are going to do that sort of thing need to be aware of so they can avoid the pitfalls that so many men have fallen into before them. So you can have a permanent relationship with a woman, just be aware of her nature, your nature, and the state's nature, and never ever sign on the dotted line of a marriage contract. Also be aware of common law in your state. You could be living with a woman you're not even dating or having sex with for a period of time, and suddenly the state has decided that you're married and she can come after you for alimony. That's one of many things that men entering into long term relationships with women (that exclude eventual consensual marriage) need to be aware of before they go traipsing into a mine field.

"never share your possessions"

Now I'm not entirely sure where Dr. Peterson got this from. There are a few MGTOW forums out there on the internet, but I don't use forums in any capacity, so he very well could've read something from mgtow.com or wherever else and picked this up. Once again, MGTOW is a very individualistic philosophy, so you could probably ask 10 MGTOW about this and get about 15 different answers. My personal take on it is that I don't see the issue with sharing your possessions. One of my female friends (whom I also work with on a podcast that we're producing) needed a better microphone because she was working with a headset, and she's voicing one of the main characters in that podcast. I had just gotten a new mic to replace my Blue Snowball, so I gave her the Snowball because I didn't need it anymore and she needed a decent microphone. I'm also not interested in engaging romantically with her, not just for the reasons outlined above, but because she's currently engaged to another of my friends, and honestly I have no romantic interest in her. Besides, they're an adorable couple, and it would be a crime against nature for me to attempt to get between them in any fashion, other than joking that I'm going to steal her man one day. This point really does seem like nonsense to me, and like I said I have no idea where he got it from. Even interpreting it liberally I can't think of anything that I remember any of the MGTOW thinkers that I subscribe to mentioning anything like this. Although it's a large well of knowledge to draw on, so it could just be a situation where he read or heard something that I didn't.

"make sure you never live together"

Once again this can be interpreted several ways, depending on where you live. Some states don't have common law marriage. In those cases it's probably okay to live with a woman, so long as you lay out firm boundaries with regards to who's paying bills, who primarily owns or rents the living space, and so on and so forth. That's up to the individual MGTOW, to be honest, and someone like me wouldn't live with a woman because on the whole I find living with others to be tiresome and cumbersome, and had I the choice I would live alone. Unfortunately I'm not quite so lucky as to be able to decide that yet, and so I deal. But once again, what Dr. Peterson is doing here is taking one of the most extreme positions (one I admittedly hold) from a wide range of opinions and using that to characterize the philosophy as a whole. It's a bit dishonest, but again I'll chalk that up to ignorance or visceral emotional reaction on his part rather than any intentional malice to mischaracterize MGTOW.

"and don't stay with one long enough to enter a common law relationship because you will be stripped of everything that you have."

This kind of contradicts his last point in the list, but I'll say that this is more due to him working from the top of his head because he wasn't speaking with notes in front of him. I don't think he meant to contradict himself in this mischaracterization of MGTOW, but he did, and it needs to be brought up. We all make mistakes, after all. But yes, this is a very, very real concern. I've heard of guys who were living with a woman in a state with common law marriage, split up, and then were come after for alimony. God forbid they were living with a single mother, in which case they were come after for alimony and child support for a child that was not theirs and for whom they were not the primary caregiver. These men didn't even have to be in a sexual relationship with these women. And yet the state decides that he must take care of her and whatever progeny she has, whether or not those kids are actually his. These are some of the horror stories that have driven men like myself to the assessment that living with a woman is too great of a risk and should be avoided entirely if at all possible. This doesn't even have to be done out of greed or malice on the part of the woman. She can apply for government benefits, they see that she lived with this guy for enough time to qualify as common law married, and decide that instead of shelling out taxpayer dollars they'll just foot the bill to this poor sod, who's now on the hook for god only knows how many years. She can even specifically request that they not do it and the state can still put the guy on the hook. Men have no rights in this situation. The only logical recourse is to not put yourself in the position to be taken advantage of like that. This is very good advice that Dr. Peterson is maligning through some misplaced sense of duty, or traditionalism, or romance, or whatever his motivations might be. But the fact remains that this does happen to men, and it is not something to be offhandedly dismissed.

"Well that's a hell of a thing to be telling people..."

Yes. It is. Especially since it's all true, to one degree or another depending on your interpretation. Except that bit about sharing possessions, at least to my knowledge.


"...but what's happened is that the female has been manifested in their life as only the negative archetype and they've got that confused with ALL WOMEN."

You're embarrassing yourself now, Doctor. This is how I know you haven't done adequate research into MGTOW. Some men, yes, have had the female manifest in their life as only the negative archetype. Messenger Rising might be a good example, although I don't know if his ex-wife is the only negative female archetype he's experienced, or if all the women in his life were just evil. Then you have men like me. Most of my experience with women has been good, apart from some failed romantic endeavors. I love my female friends, and I assume they love me as well. My mother, while she could fly off the handle at times, loved me very much, and I her before cancer took her from us. I've had plenty of female teachers that were a joy to be taught by. And my last girlfriend I enjoyed a very loving relationship with up until the last few months. It's not about confusing bad women with all women.

It's about recognizing that all women have the potential to be bad women, and what's more will not be punished but rewarded at your expense for this bad behavior, should they choose to act on those darker impulses. You're confusing the phrase "AWALT" (All Women Are Like That) with forcing a negative stereotype onto women based on the worst examples of the sex. AWALT describes a certain set of biological factors that have been bred into women via evolution over thousands of years that all women have to one degree or another, and will choose to act or not act on depending on their position or situation. Hypergamy, the tendency for women to look for the best opportunity to have someone take care of her and her children, is a fact in all women. Whether or not those women indulge it, or even know it's there, is largely up to them. The fact that "all women are like that" (ie hypergamous) is no moral referendum on women, it's just how they are. Just like men are generally bigger and stronger. The moral referendum comes in when women choose to act on their hypergamy to the detriment of a man she has chosen to victimize to serve that hypergamy. Those women can be classed as "evil" because they are specifically engaged in behaviors in service to their base nature that has the effect of putting another human being into a position of enslavement, imprisonment, or suicide. Sometimes all three. Does that mean all women will do such a thing? No, of course not. Once again, Karen Straughan is a perfect example. But all women have the capacity to do that, and what's more they're encouraged to by their environment if they live in a moderately mechanized society with a sufficient level of social advancement that affords them the opportunity to get a better deal and just collect a check every month instead of dealing with the man attached to the money.

Once again, all women have the capacity, and enough of them act on it to make men suspicious, and justifiably so, of entering into contracts with them. Or putting themselves into the position to be forcibly entered into a contract against their will by the state. This is shown in the men who take women from traditional societies (rural China, for instance), bring them over to America, marry them, and as soon as she's got citizenship she divorces the man and takes half his shit. Guaranteed if they'd stayed living in rural China she would've been a devoted wife, because her survival would've depended on him providing for her. but in America the laws are so enabling that she doesn't have to abide by anything that the man might've thought he was getting into. This happens very frequently, but isn't the only measurement. Just look at, once again, China's formerly rural areas that are becoming more modernized. Soon as they do, and women have other options than marriage, divorces skyrocket and we see numbers comparable to what we currently have in the West, with something like a 35-50% divorce rate, and women initiating divorces 65-75% of the time. The reason for this has to be something other than human opportunism, otherwise the rates would even out. There's something deeper, and MGTOW call it hypergamy. These numbers are seen in a rough approximation wherever something like no-fault divorce and alimony are instituted. We see comparable numbers in America, Canada, the UK, China, Indonesia, Australia, India, all over the world. There is simply something about women that makes them more prone to divorce when they aren't dependent on a man directly for their survival, and that's something that men need to be aware of.

Yes, all women are like that. No, not all women act on it.

But how many meat grinders are you willing to go through before you find the diamond in the rough?

For many men like myself, the answer is precisely zero. The juice isn't worth the squeeze, to quote Barbarossaa.

"And that's partly...you know you gotta ask yourself, if you know the mythological stories, maybe if you made the right sacrifices you wouldn't have so much trouble with women. It's a good question to ask yourself first, and I would also say...you know if you're a woman who has trouble with men, or you're a man who has trouble with women, it's not the women, and it's not the men. It's you. Because the women are telling you what's wrong with you, and the men are telling you what's wrong with you, and if you don't listen, it's either you or all men. Well that's easy it's all men. That's certainly how it's played out in the world right now. No. It's not all men. By definition. By definition. And it's not all women, that's for sure. "I don't wanna have anything to do with women." You're a pathetic weasel. That's the same statement."

More of the "MGTOW is just feminism for men!" garbage. That's not explicitly what he said, but it's what he meant, let's not be intellectually dishonest here. This argument has been debunked so many times, by Barbarossaa, by Stardusk, by RagingGoldenEagle, by TurdFlingingMonkey, and dozens of other MGTOW that I shouldn't have to waste my time on it. But, because Dr. Peterson has done so little research into the phenomenon he seems to despise on such a visceral level, I will.

Sacrifices? Like the men who've blown their brains out because their kids were taken away from them even though they did nothing wrong? Did they make the appropriate sacrifices? Or the guys I mentioned that get common law married to a single mother who they weren't even romantically involved with and were forced to pay alimony and child support? Did they make the appropriate sacrifices? Was that their penance for not doing so? What about the kid who was raped by his female teacher, she got pregnant, waited till he was 18, then came after him for child support? What sacrifices should he have made to not have so much "trouble with women," Dr. Peterson? What wrong could that child have possibly committed to warrant such a steep penalty? I realize these are emotional examples and the last is quite extreme, but I'm doing this to demonstrate that Dr. Peterson has a fundamental misunderstanding of what he's dealing with.

He's coming from a position of a happy marriage where he earns enough to keep his wife satisfied, gets to see his kids every day that he's not traveling on business, and has relatively little to worry about because even if he had lost his job due to that joke of a Canadian court he was dragged through he has enough supporters on the internet (thanks in part to people like MRA's and MGTOW's, I might add) that he could probably make a successful living writing books and doing speaking engagements and making YouTube videos (patroeon is a thing, after all); and he has the audacity to tell these men who have had their lives ripped away by callous, unfeeling, evil women that they would've been okay if they'd made the appropriate sacrifices? What sacrifices should Messenger have made to not get dragged through the kangaroo courts in his country and had his entire life go to shit thanks to his vindictive ex-wife? You're going to look these good men who were taken advantage of in the metaphorical eye and tell them that it's their fault that the legal system was already stacked against them and the women they'd attached themselves to decided to take advantage of it? On behalf of those men, and with all due respect, fuck you. You are the equivalent of the person who won the Power Ball Lottery telling everybody you know to buy scratch-off tickets because you won the big prize. You have no understanding of the pain the men you so casually deride as romantically unsuccessful have gone through, and I pray to god that you never do.

This isn't about romantic problems. As I laid out above, many MGTOW have successful romantic lives. This is about human nature, male and female, and the legal system that we all exist in that encourages and rewards women for indulging in the darker parts of their nature at the expense of the men who loved them. This is about men seeing a system that is so stacked against them that they'd have to be ten different kinds of idiot to try to run that obstacle course. This is about a minefield that you're sitting there from your pretty, secure position on the sidelines, yelling at men to run into because it's "the right thing to do," and those men saying, "Hell no," and walk away with all their limbs intact. And then you come out with that old, tired line that basically boils down to, "Well you probably can't get laid."

Because that's what you're talking about here. These men have been taken apart by the legal system and greedy, spiteful, evil, vindictive women, and according to you it's their fault that they've been taken advantage of. We've turned our backs on romantic relationships because we've either experienced the consequences or can see them full well, and it's our fault that we have "trouble with women." If only they'd been more discerning, right? If only they'd made better choices in romantic partners, right? If only they'd properly vetted their partners, right?

Well a lot of men, myself included, have decided to hell with that. We don't need it. We're better off without it. We're happier, we have more money to spend on the things we want to spend it on, we have more time for our hobbies, we have more time to hang out with friends, we have more time to devote to our careers. We don't need romantic partners, or children, or any of that traditionalist horseshit. We're out here redefining masculinity on our own terms in a world that despises masculinity, and for that we ought to be commended. We're the one label in this massive war of identity politics that is an apparent threat to literally everybody, including MRA's. As the meme above states, "I am not on anybody's side, because nobody is on my side."

Nobody is on men's side. Nobody with any power, anyway. MRA's try, but they're still hung up on changing a gynocentric legal system in which women are 54% of voters. Nothing will come of it. Even the PUA's like Roosh are starting to go MGTOW-lite, because despite their thick fucking skulls and addiction to pussy some shit is starting to seep in. MGTOW is the only philosophy that actually offers men the tools with which they can protect themselves from this society and legal system that seeks to take advantage of them even unto their death. We're hated by traditionalists, PUA's, "rational skeptics", white nationalists, black nationalists, the alt-right, the far left, Republicans, Democrats, even MRA's to an extent, although we used to be allies. Because we help men. We save men's lives. We not only arm men with the tools to protect themselves but give them a place to unashamedly air their grievances without fear of reproach, and for that we're called misogynists. Even by someone who has been so manhandled by feminism as Dr. Jordan Peterson.

The statements that he's attempting to compare by simplifying one down to the level of the other are not even close to the same thing, either in meaning or in action. I've already explained AWALT, and won't do so again. But action is a different story. Feminists state that all men are rapists, evil, depraved, manspreading, male gaze, etc etc ad nauseum. MGTOW state that there are aspects of female and male nature that men need to be aware of, and then lay out different paths for dealing with them. The big difference here is that we're harming nobody. We do not seek government power, we do not seek to change laws, we do not seek to inflict our vision of the world on anybody else. Not only is feminism wrong in its assertion of men's nature, it seeks to impose this vision of men on the entire world by the barrel of a gun. MGTOW does no such thing. We have theories, hypotheses, conjecture backed up by evidence both statistical and anecdotal, and we deliver these to any who would listen on demand, for free, asking nothing in return. Not legal changes, not that anybody conform to our ideas, not that we be put in charge of a god damned thing, and not even your respect or kind treatment to those of us who've been damaged.

Because we know you won't give it.

So we sack up and deal with the slings and arrows of the ignorant, like Dr. Peterson in this instance. We soldier on, and every once in a while a guy picks up what we're laying down and saves himself some absolute hell. And that's worth it. That's what we're trying to do. We're trying to save men's lives right now, not in some mythical utopia years down the road that won't ever materialize.

If that makes us "pathetic weasels" then I for one am willing to live with that appellation. At least we aren't commanding men to run into a minefield and then blaming them for getting their legs blown off.